1. Welcome to SocialHangar.net! The place where everything Airlines is shared, discussed and debated. Whether you're a frequent traveler or a fan of airliners and airports you'll be able to find what you need here...so browse around, take a look and register if you like what you see. Registration is simple...just click on the 'Sign Up Now' link to the right of this message to get your FREE account (you can also choose to register using Facebook). Once you register this message will disappear. Hope you'll join us!

Major league pitcher killed in plane crash..

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Richard Wyeroski, Nov 7, 2017.

  1. Richard Wyeroski

    Richard Wyeroski Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2012
    Messages:
    8,826
    Likes Received:
    21,095
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    Lord Leighton and Rotorruss like this.
  2. Rotorruss

    Rotorruss Hangar Silver Member IV

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2016
    Messages:
    2,343
    Likes Received:
    4,622
    Trophy Points:
    301
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    ...well, at least he didn't hit a building buzzing downtown like another ball player did.

    LSA structures only have a "consensus standards". "Looks good enough to me" can kill you!
     
  3. Richard Wyeroski

    Richard Wyeroski Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2012
    Messages:
    8,826
    Likes Received:
    21,095
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    The accident Light Sport Aircraft.
    200k......purchase price
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
     
    Lord Leighton likes this.
  4. Rotorruss

    Rotorruss Hangar Silver Member IV

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2016
    Messages:
    2,343
    Likes Received:
    4,622
    Trophy Points:
    301
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    ...yeah, another reach out and "bite ya" airframe. It's sad that the manufacturer's company pilots were killed in another airframe.
     
    Richard Wyeroski likes this.
  5. Richard Wyeroski

    Richard Wyeroski Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2012
    Messages:
    8,826
    Likes Received:
    21,095
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    I have never been a fan of LSA. I think they are over priced and built poorly, compared to certified aircraft. Selling price for LSA is 160-200k. For that kind of money one could get a great pre-owned certified aircraft.

    I have flown 3 different LSA aircraft. They seemed okay however they are not supported by the AD system. FAA looks the other way on this and when they crash FAA seems to not investigate very throughly because they are not certified!

    All that needs to be done is add 350 pounds to the max take off weight and the aircraft falls into the Cessna 150/152 category.
     
    Lord Leighton and Rotorruss like this.
  6. Rotorruss

    Rotorruss Hangar Silver Member IV

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2016
    Messages:
    2,343
    Likes Received:
    4,622
    Trophy Points:
    301
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    ....ding, ding, ding!! BINGO!! The biggest crime of ALL!!! LOOKING THE OTHER WAY!!!! I hear that Ms. Piggy got another international award. Now you can see where the LSA "corruption" came from?
     
  7. Richard Wyeroski

    Richard Wyeroski Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2012
    Messages:
    8,826
    Likes Received:
    21,095
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    FAA was lobbied heavily (paid-off) to keep the LSA weight in the US down at 1,320 lbs. It would have been a shot in the arm for General Aviation if FAA at the time allowed our legacy 2 place trainers to fall into the LSA category. This would have helped the G/A industry. Most LSA aircraft are made in foreign countries. They have poor support for parts and problems in the field.

    I watched the flight school in my area wreck every LSA they had, only to have the manufacturers tell them they do not recommend to use them for flight training.

    I have seen US manufactured LSA aircraft that were built very well and had support because the company was based here.

    Ironically refurb companies are remanufacturing Cessna 150/152/172 for a reasonable dollar that are literally like new aircraft. They are much better aircraft and will be available for the next crop of pilots in the future!

    A GREAT BUY FOR UNDER 100k
    http://www.boldmethod.com/blog/articles/2014/08/reimagined/

    FAA has hurt G/A with their America last attitude. I only hope in the future that the FAA management is replaced with people that believe in making America great again............like our President is doing
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2017
    Lord Leighton and Rotorruss like this.
  8. Rotorruss

    Rotorruss Hangar Silver Member IV

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2016
    Messages:
    2,343
    Likes Received:
    4,622
    Trophy Points:
    301
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    ...if the "Agency" would put the same effort as they do for UAS, we would have a "great" GA community. Some of the "high price" is from the "legal system" run amuck, where everyone had to pay for the liability. Or, so we are told. The "agency" took in LSA with open arms. The accident rate was bad enough that NTSB took note. The NTSB has no teeth, so the message fell on deaf ears. There are so many things to fix, but some figure that the "biggly one" can right the ship. The "Feds" need wake up, before it's too late and the world passes them by. Depending on what happens after January 8. 2018, we'll either a surge for GA and it's greatness, or the coffin nail
     
    Richard Wyeroski likes this.
  9. Richard Wyeroski

    Richard Wyeroski Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2012
    Messages:
    8,826
    Likes Received:
    21,095
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    It seems that senior Managment has set up their new empire. What will the new administrator think of the whole thing?
     
    Rotorruss likes this.
  10. Lord Leighton

    Lord Leighton Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Messages:
    15,490
    Likes Received:
    32,657
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    An ICON A-5 none the less. I wanna see more particulars on this. He had a passion for flying too. What was he doing when this happened? Hmm.
     
    Richard Wyeroski and Rotorruss like this.
  11. Rotorruss

    Rotorruss Hangar Silver Member IV

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2016
    Messages:
    2,343
    Likes Received:
    4,622
    Trophy Points:
    301
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    Yes they do and they will punish anyone that will expose them. It will take a "great pilot" to "right the ship"!
     
  12. Rotorruss

    Rotorruss Hangar Silver Member IV

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2016
    Messages:
    2,343
    Likes Received:
    4,622
    Trophy Points:
    301
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
  13. Exuma Guy

    Exuma Guy Hangar Silver Member VI

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2012
    Messages:
    3,228
    Likes Received:
    8,151
    Trophy Points:
    551
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    Bahamas Bahamas
    A few comments-
    LSA's are NOT like certified aircraft and were not intended to be. The weight class was established to reduce the cost of sport flying. Flight training schools are NOT sport flying. The onus of design safety is on the pilots, not the FAA. I prefer to keep the FAA from trying to 'rescue' the LSA program.

    The Icon A-5 is marketed as being extremely easy to fly. This has caused buyers to have a jet-ski mentality towards flying. It's a very dangerous philosophy being sold by the manufacturer. It's akin to Airbus training pilots to trust the airplane because it knows better than the pilots. Airbus's philosophy changed after AF-447 accident, and Icon should stop promoting this philosophy for the same reason. I have posted previously about this.

    There is contention in the aero-design community about the sponson design of the Icon. The sponsons are effectively a small delta wing. Delta wing planforms have drag curves that rise steeply as angle of attack increases. This can cause unintended high sink rates (one of the Icon accidents was a hard landing). Icon's designers claim to have solved this problem with careful selections of airfoils. but I reserve judgement until I get my hands on one.
     
  14. Richard Wyeroski

    Richard Wyeroski Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2012
    Messages:
    8,826
    Likes Received:
    21,095
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    I constantly read that a student can earn his LSA Certificate in 20 hours. An LSA Private Pilot with 125 hours can become an LSA Instructor.
    Lowering standards have caused accidents.

    The only limitation these pilots have is to be restricted to LSA Aircraft.
     
    Lord Leighton and Rotorruss like this.
  15. Richard Wyeroski

    Richard Wyeroski Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2012
    Messages:
    8,826
    Likes Received:
    21,095
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    Lord Leighton and Rotorruss like this.
  16. Rotorruss

    Rotorruss Hangar Silver Member IV

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2016
    Messages:
    2,343
    Likes Received:
    4,622
    Trophy Points:
    301
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    .. unfortunately, it will only go as far as the next sensational story. The alphabet groups won't say much because they don't want the "feds" bore scoping their "business". As long as, the "feds" manipulate the "numbers" to keep them low, everyone wins. Except, the victim's family!!
     
  17. Lord Leighton

    Lord Leighton Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Messages:
    15,490
    Likes Received:
    32,657
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    Rotorruss likes this.
  18. Lord Leighton

    Lord Leighton Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2013
    Messages:
    15,490
    Likes Received:
    32,657
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    Because they flew into a Box canyon. Not the plane's fault.
     
    Rotorruss likes this.
  19. Richard Wyeroski

    Richard Wyeroski Hangar Gold Member I

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2012
    Messages:
    8,826
    Likes Received:
    21,095
    Trophy Points:
    926
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    **An example of aircraft specs. are listed below. .....The company has required that customers sign agreements to not sue the company? Supposedly special pilot training is required. Additional requirements must be agreed to before a customer could purchase an aircraft?

    I has been a while since I have flown pusher type aircraft. They definitely handle different, to use a word. An example is adding power the nose of the aircraft goes down. reducing power and the nose of the aircraft goes up. This is the opposite of aircraft with engines mounted in front.

    Landing on water is definitely different then on land. For one thing the landing gear must be in the up position when landing on water. Serious accidents have occurred when pilots did the opposite. I have no numbers on the structural strength of this aircraft. however according to company specifications, maximum operating speed is limited to 121 knots.

    The aircraft is definitely futuristic. A definitely modern 21st century cockpit.

    Just what kind of training This pilot received will be investigated. He was a new pilot having just received his LSA pilot Certificate.

    The investigation begins and because of this pilot's fame, the NTSB and FAA will immediately respond.

    More to come I am sure

    **Aircraft Specifications
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ICON_A5
     
    Lord Leighton and Rotorruss like this.
  20. Rotorruss

    Rotorruss Hangar Silver Member IV

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2016
    Messages:
    2,343
    Likes Received:
    4,622
    Trophy Points:
    301
    Gender:
    Male
    Country:
    United States United States
    ...grant it, both crashes will go down as pilot error. Most light weight structures will offer less occupant protection. I wonder what did the manufacturer sacrifice in order to meet the sport pilot weight limit? Energy transfer through the airframe to the occupant is not a good thing. I understand that some crashes aren't survivable. We'll see if this one was blunt force trauma or drowning.
     

Share This Page